Meeting — January 13, 2020

Attendees: alignwaiver, mray, Salt, wolftune


Discourse (over past week):

  • Signups: 0 -> 0
  • New Topics: 4 -> 6
  • Posts: 24 -> 65

Reminders on best-practice habits

Sociocracy stuff

  • Drivers, describing driver statements:
    • Current situation + effect + what’s needed + impact of doing it
    • forum discussion of our use:
    • Objections vs concerns
    • Example of proposal phase:

Use of GitLab kanban boards

  • Use the boards to pick your tasks, dragging or marking To Do and Doing appropriately
  • e.g. wolftune’s:

Conversation queuing

  • “o/” or “/” means that you have something to say and want to be put in the queue
  • “c/” or “?” means that you have a clarifying question and want to jump to the top of the queue
  • “d” means thumbs up, encouragement, agreement, etc.
  • “>” as an indicator of understanding someone and the point can be concluded, please move on
  • three discussion mechanisms: hand symbols (above), call for a round, open discussion


  • “???” on the etherpad means the notetaker missed something and needs assistance capturing what was said
  • aim for shorthand / summary / key points (not transcript)

Review previous meeting feedback

  • salt: took too long, 15 minutes to get to actual agenda today
  • mray: went well, salt facilitated well
  • wolftune: liked stephens ‘>’ symbol
  • salt: like advanced agenda planning
  • alignwaivers: workflow is getting better, valueable use of time
  • mseip: good meeting

Review last meeting’s action steps

## Mumble server public / wiki / on pad? (wolftune)
- NEXT STEP (wolftune): check with iko [done]
## Advanced agenda planning & coworking time for meetings (alignwaivers)
- NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): use the pad for adding agenda, make this clear in appropriate places [done], and notifying people to review agenda with couple day advanced notice
## Shared Calendar / Automated Reminders (alignwaivers)
- NEXT STEPS (alignwaivers): review previous past discussion and resources (for available / ideal tech - check discourse plugin [done] as well)
## Update meeting time? (Salt)
- NEXT STEP (alignwaivers pings on this): decide by next week about continuing time; everyone get your times up to date (including those not currently attending) [done]
## LFNW call for presenters, booth plans, etc (wolftune)
- NEXT STEP: discussion thread
- NEXT STEP (salt): get in proposals, including a Snowdrift-focused one (at least as stub)
## BoD, meeting, support, transparency / updates (wolftune)
- NEXT STEP (wolftune): schedule board meeting (and ping alignwaivers to be notetaker)
## Marking prominently that we're under-construction (carry-over)
- NEXT STEP (smichel17): Privately reach out to h30, make sure to mention the 'under construction' site banner issue
- NEXT STEP (alignwaivers):  check in with smichel17 on this [done]
## Code development progress / site building (carry-over)
- NEXT STEP (chreekat): deploy updated site, then after the updated site is deployed, run the backlog of crowdmatches
- NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): ping chreekrat on this [done]
## Issue grooming / dumping etc (carry-over)
- NEXT STEP (align_waivers): write first draft of a grooming-guide
- NEXT STEP (alignwaivers ping smichel17): Delete or close the LFNW 2019 milestone <>
- NEXT STEP (alignwaivers + smichel + wolftune + msiep): schedule grooming session
- NEXT STEP (msiep): groom design repo issues
- NEXT STEPS (alignwaivers): groom labels (planning this, forum post, issue for this), [done] []
- NEXT STEP (wolftune): add note about issue management to plans for role updates etc [done]
## Volunteer recruiting application (carry-over)
- NEXT STEP (salt): continue to monitor state of civicrm
## State of pad vs when captured on wiki (wolftune)
- NEXT STEP (wolftune): capture / codify this idea (don't move carry-overs, but make new agenda referencing it) in the pad notes (maybe also on wiki) [done] (see bottom of this page)
- NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): take on role in future meetings (after process captured) [done]

team agreements based on photms baseline proposal (alignwaivers)

  • (photm asks: is this link the right one? baseline proposal sounds like you mean )
  • GitLab link:
  • photm’s suggestion was pushing toward meeting attendance really priority (decision-making by only attendees is important)
  • alignwaivers: we could draft something more nuanced / flexible
  • wolftune: key is to get something everyone agrees on right now - have bullet points of all the things we may or may note be including, come to consensus (and invite other members)
  • wolftune: before we have that can’t discuss
  • NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): adapt the draft, short bullet points for everyone to consent to (after revision / finalizing)
  • salt: big concern about overhead / hurdles etc.
  • salt: the formalization / documentation (that might feel like a EULA) would feel imposing / discouraging to potential new recruits
  • wolftune: iterative process should be worked out separately, breaking down into steps : basic expectations for team members - including it won’t be weeks before you respond
  • alignwaivers: agree with concerns, this should not be a barrier to participation

Chat on ether pad chat instead of mumble (alignwaivers)

  • (alignwaivers) -how about using the etherpad chat instead of Mumble to avoid switching back and forth between different devices (if using a phone for mumble,etc) or windows on computer?
  • NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): trying it out this meeting, mark a note in the pad structure to capture this for future reference and review as we go

Shared Calendar / Automated Reminders (alignwaivers)

  • alignwaivers: discourse calendar plugin not worthwhile, seems we need a hosted system of some sort
  • NEXT STEP (wolftune): add shared-calendar needs to OSUOSL trello, mention NextCloud as option
  • alignwaivers: also going to do some personal testing on pi
  • wolftune: asking OSU about what options are available vs. asking to host a nextcloud
  • salt: nextcloud would be great in many ways, so that’s ideal if OSU is willing (but posit as a primary option and be open to others)

Timekeeping during meetings? (wolftune)

  • wolftune: just a thought, it’s a tool people use but maybe we don’t need
  • salt: seems not an immediate problem, we’re doing well

Cleaning up the meeting reminders phase (wolftune)

  • wolftune: maybe should stick to meeting reminders about the meeting itself, vs. ways of bringing up new things
  • salt: generally nonsensible to repeat the same things, but one reminder probably fine. Perhaps a quarterly reminder instead (or when there is a new participant)
  • wolftune: meetings starting with reminder of the mission, useful for focusing meeting, reminder about sociocracy tools seem inappropriate
  • salt: affirmation is interesting, but I like seeing reminders about certain things like drivers
  • wolftune: general intention that each of the reminders be framed in a way that is optimized for meeting - i.e. make a meeting driver statement for connecting reminders to meeting
  • salt calls for a round
  • alignwaivers: intention idea is nice
  • mray: fine as long it remains natural to all involved and doesn’t take too long
  • salt: as long as it doesn’t take too long, frame reminder of intention as a statement. maybe a different person reads every time
  • wolftune: starting at beginning makes sense, connects with the juxtaposition on opening round, adapt as we go, and also potential for other reminders that could fit, i.e. kanban board reminder
  • NEXT STEP (wolftune): draft a driver statement for meeting affirmation etc.

LFNW (Salt)

  • salt submitted talks, not even recalling if snowdrift one was included, will be there
  • 2 days left for CFP!
  • wolftune: should probably look at updating the lfnw milestone
  • NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): creation/update of milestone and all that entails

Site updating, e.g. marking under construction design implementation (salt)

  • salt: reminders of reminders of reminders doesn’t seem useful
  • wolftune:this relates to volunteer recruitment, certain things on the site need to be implemented which is captured. also relates to team agreements, doesn’t want to remind people who haven’t made agreement. Note from random person about how great snowdrift website is even with javascript turned off, offered for the person to get involved and learn
  • salt: yeah, continual pinging doesn’t seem right; item needs to get done, next step is to find someone who can do it
  • NEXT STEP (salt): specifically work on recruiting qualified volunteer(s)

Issue grooming Guide (alignwaivers)

  • alignwaivers: I feel slow on this, but I’m making progress on understanding whole grand project-management issues, and how snowdrift adopts these tools
  • could draft a guide to how we use issues (or should), I need to make sense of it all and document
  • easy to get perfectionistic, but we need good enough to move forward
  • NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): post draft of issue guide
  • wolftune: I’m currently writing for IEEE a guide to all the elements of FLO projects for those unfamiliar with open source stuff (the exact text is apache licensed awkwardly so the exact stuff might not be usable, but the ideas)

Marking new agenda as about continuing something from last meeting (wolftune)

  • alignwaivers: makes sense copy/pasting, so we know what goes with it rather than typing it the ‘new version’ without it being a clear carryover
  • salt: copy and paste and clean up as we discuss it, tension was around marking “carry-over” specifically whether okay or not
  • NEXT STEP (alignwaivers): put this on the pad, updated process about clearing old, marking distinction
  • wolftune: just don’t want it to be in a loop
  • salt: have a mark to put in after the old commentary, distinguish new discussion
  • wolftune: clear marking for next step, don’t want to use the same marking (marking old steps as prior steps, etc)
  • alignwaivers: minimize / get rid of (during discussion) the non-essential copy/pasted old stuff (which is partially just a marker)

meeting evaluation / feedback / suggestions round

  • alignwaivers: pad chat worked for me (really helpful), but it doesn’t make an audible ping, perhaps some markings within the pad text itself
  • mray: created a snowdrift meeting matrix chatroom, use next to etherpad / mumble / jitsi
  • Salt: we are doing a lot with process rather than other substance but it seems necessary and worthwhile
  • wolftune: surprised it took an hour with less starting agenda, but felt like progress made, not too much wasted time, taking notes while participating otherwise is hard (took over for alignwaivers often), would be ideal to get non-participant note-taker